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Land Air Sea
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Poll Result
  What form of terrain accesibility do you like most?  
 
Land-Air-Sea Most notable: Total Anihilation, Warcraft2
47%
 47%  [ 17 ]
Land-Air Most notable: Starcraft, Warcraft3
25%
 25%  [ 9 ]
Land-Sea Most notable: Nothing comes to mind, feel free to suggest
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Land-Land Most notable: Nothing comes to mind, feel free to suggest
5%
 5%  [ 2 ]
Soap Tastes Funny!
22%
 22%  [ 8 ]
 
  Total Votes : 36  

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Bobacles



Joined: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 123



PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder, how will planes be done? Will they be like the flying units/tanks of Starcraft, that anything with a gun can shoot? Or will they be hi-speed hit+run deathtraps of TA, that only a few AA missiles can take out?
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Poo Bear
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Joined: 14 Oct 2002
Posts: 4121
Location: Sheffield, UK



PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Planes aren't implemented yet but I was favouring the Starcraftean approach, which basically makes a fast moving hovering platform. Which is really just a tank but usually fast/weaker/lighter.
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icarus
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Joined: 01 Mar 2004

Location: Olympia Washington



PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2004 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yah exept tanks cant go thro buildings over water and past cliffs
and cant go thro forest whithout being slowed down

(how do you spell thro?)
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X-Fighter
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Joined: 07 Mar 2004

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 29, 2004 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For what it's worth, I'm mainly into the tactical usage aspects and apparent logic--not just the "more features are better!" thing.
I despise having terrains which are clearly visible, but I cannot use(43% of the map is water, and we can't even build a canoe???), and I also despise dense domination(Where a very stupid person with a very large weapon can become virtually invincible.)

Hence, I'd desperately want sea units, unless there will be 0% water on 100% of the maps. I'd desperately want air units unless there will be 0% land obstructions on 100% of the maps.

I'd also like the concepts of subterranean/space things, because I can imagine ways that you'd not only want to, but need to use both.(Such as tunnelling under a mountain range that's covered with 500 anti-aircraft artillery units that are out-of-range of your ground teams, or setting up a colony on some moon to increase your mining production once the enemy has managed to level your planet-based resource towns.)

Also, some of the cross-feature attacks for both of those would be cool, such as being able to fire ground-penetration missiles that fill tunnels with acidic goo, or plant minefields as you pass under well-travelled enemy terrain, or, the beloved clich'e, the orbital space station assault(You know the type, giant beam comes out of the sky, followed by a cool neon-colored(blue/green/purple) explosion). Oh, and let's not forget platform launchers-- space-based launching platforms for air units, and underground sea/land/air launching units(think "the BatCave", only mobile!)

It would make the game seriously cooler, and expand the tactical spectrum by the umpteenth power, with only moderate amounts of additonal coding(if you've already set up land/sea/air, the other two would be relatively easy to extend to).


Last edited by X-Fighter on Wed Mar 31, 2004 12:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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icarus
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Joined: 01 Mar 2004

Location: Olympia Washington



PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2004 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yah you should be able to build tunnels or have a unit that can dig and then pop out of the ground and shoot lazers.
and to balince it make it so explosins on the serfice could colapse tunnels and have bunker busting missles and devices that can find vibrations from infintry veicles and diggers.

and space baseed supper wepons are cool to like zuse from FFSW (a big orbital plasma canon for those who dount know) or soal from akira (a big orbatal laszer that can blast somones arm of from orbit) maby you could build space senters in the citys and make spy satalites (no fog of war) orbital drops (put camandos behind enamy lines) and best of all space based supper wepons!. but thay would be onle useful when they are overhead and the super wepons have to recarge or thay over heat and expload!

(more latter)
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starscape junkie



Joined: 15 Jun 2003
Posts: 177
Location: The Thirteenth Colony



PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2004 4:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, basically quality>qauntity
we dont want insane amounts of the map unusable
and the most desireable would be space-air-land-sea-subterrainian

might i suggest for the space idea, there be only(and this is using a the cube model in the dev diary) 1 single area. This would mean that only one player(and or allies) could control satelite monitering( no big space cannons please, because then it completely becomes about space )

Ideally, you might be able to get some forewarning of where your enemies are moving, or you might be able to paint you enemies, so you have a greater chance of missiles hitting(or somesuch)

This would, while being useful, would only give you a slight tactical advantage, and you would have to put massive resourses into puttting up a satelite(with no defenses) so it could be shot down at half the cost it would take to put it up there(so its balanced, and there is no gaurentee how long you satelite will last)

Basically, if you are winning, it might be a worthwhile investment, but if you are barely hanging on, putting mass amounts into a satelite would just weaken you further, and so it would be more cost effective and strategic to just shoot it down and let your enemy waste all thier resourses on it, giving you a chance to rebound.

The only main thing i hate about the land-air on planets is that a race is so advanced, but they cant make boats. If you do it that way, could you at least make it some thing about the water being so acidic it eats away at the ships, and they last only a few minutes, so producing them would be foolhardy?

Subterranean would be nice, but rather hard to implement(and id rather have good pathfinding and a smart ai), Starscape Junkie
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X-Fighter
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Joined: 07 Mar 2004

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Balance against space domination: Well, for one, the "space cannons", always require some ground-bound guidance system, traditionally. Secondly, if you have the subterranean option, these kinds of units would most obviously be immune to almost anything at all in space(the fire has to cross space, air, land, and then into the ground to do any damage! Not likely.) Lastly, weather, if in the game(I haven't seen anything discussing this yet), would obviously cause issues(You can't easily hit a moving target aiming through a cloud).

It's also noteworthy that satellites, to be "workable", would either be a geo-synch that's stuck at a fixed position(can only hit 1 spot on the map), or an orbial(can hit anywhere, but only in passing in range--it has to circle all-the-way-around the planet in between each shot... that could take a long time(Normally, in reality, about 90 minutes). Also, optionally, Orbital satellites could require some kind of "path" setting... even if it's about to go over head, it has to go in a straight line, so the target area would only be a large, elongeated stripe across the battlefield.

Between cloud cover(can't see), limited ranges(can't hit), and ground control(they're dead/their signal is jammed, try and hit us now, suckas!), alot could go wrong, and if you play your strategy right, you could make enemy space superiority an obsolete waste of money and resources.

One last good measure is reverse visibility... when a satellite can hit anywhere on a map, everyone on the map can see it(think about the moon...) and if they have weapons to hit space targets, they can try to shoot it down, no matter where they're at.

I'd love to have space cruiser battles, so I'd like it if it was a indominable(not just 1 guy and his allies controlling it) terrain.

Lastly, pathing and AI would kind of lend themselves to S.T.(It's too long of a word to keep typing out). If the pathing/AI sucks, then having underground tunnels would be completely useless(nothing would be able to navigate them).

One last thought: bedrock! If you guys do the S.T., to add tactics to it, bedrock terrain could be done(places where tunnelling is either completely impossible or exceptionally difficult).
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icarus
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Joined: 01 Mar 2004

Location: Olympia Washington



PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2004 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thats what i ment space conons would be vunarble: the enamy could shoot a-sat (anti satalite) missles at them or capture them by captureing the city whare the space bace is located or attack them with spaceships. and thay would be very expensive
and thay would only be useful if thay are over head some namely spy sats would be useful as long as thay are over the horison but canons would have to be derectly overhead and thay would orbet s l o w l e y
and thay would be unreliable (if you fire it to much without letting it cool of it would over heat and go Twisted Evil BOOM! Twisted Evil )
and you could only change its orbet between battles
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LrdSilencio



Joined: 03 Apr 2004
Posts: 3
Location: Iraq



PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2004 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I could go for Land - Space. Yes, it's an inhabital planet, but no one said there were OCEANS there. So you have land warfare, and limited space warfare since tech is not up to speed yet. If unpassable terrain is needed, then the earlier suggestion of lava, or something of the like could come into play. Best example I can think of for Land - Space would be StarCraft.
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icarus
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Joined: 01 Mar 2004

Location: Olympia Washington



PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2004 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well if it is inhabited it would moast likley be an earthlike planet with life of its own simalar to earth and in an earthlike planet with life simaler to that found on earth it would have to have a lot of watter beacuse carbon based life neads watter to grow

and besides naval battles are cool
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HunterXI



Joined: 26 Dec 2003
Posts: 476
Location: Playing like there is no tomorrow.



PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2004 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

icarus wrote:
well if it is inhabited it would moast likley be an earthlike planet with life of its own simalar to earth and in an earthlike planet with life simaler to that found on earth it would have to have a lot of watter beacuse carbon based life neads watter to grow

and besides naval battles are cool


space ones are too. look at ut2k4 for example. the assult map "mothership".
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icarus
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Joined: 01 Mar 2004

Location: Olympia Washington



PostPosted: Thu Apr 08, 2004 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yah i like space battles to you could use them to destory the enamys space based supper wepon like in moonraker
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RailGun



Joined: 06 Jan 2004
Posts: 14



PostPosted: Thu Apr 08, 2004 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You guys should try Metal Fatigue, was a cool game that featured Land\Air\Sub orbital\Underground terrains. air units could fly up into the Sub orbital domain where there were platform asteroids you could build teleporters solar panels and other defences and and if anything that can't fly wasn't on a asteroid (like a bomb) it would fall through and impact the ground. the undergroind was interesting... needs to boild an elevetor te gt down there and have a drilling vehicle make the pathway, once an elevator was build any ground vehicle couldgo down it and then up another.

also suggestion for an air unit, a Dropship that can travel reigons faster than other units but needs refueling and can be shot down... it can carry several units can go to space as well and can be used to deploy reinforcements from another reigon! Very Happy IF it gets shot down there is a high cance al the units in it will die but still a chance for survivors which are gonna be in SERIOUS trouble Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil Twisted Evil
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Harabek



Joined: 10 Apr 2004
Posts: 94
Location: Arkansas, yes we have computers.



PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMO naval units can be a pain if it isn't done carefully. They can be hard to manage or so powerful they rock anything that gets close. But, the biggest problem is they may have only limited usefullness in many situations. Unless there is a lot of water on the map they are little better than fixed turrets with a rail track that they can move along. However, they could be used for logistical purposes (moving APCs across water, sheltering air units etc.) as well.

Whatever the case, I dislike having to deal with fuel and such even though it could be a crucial tool in balancing the game.
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RailGun



Joined: 06 Jan 2004
Posts: 14



PostPosted: Sat Apr 10, 2004 9:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

heh, one thing that would be nice is continents only acsessable by air or sea but too far for air units to travel and have islands, those could be defended by a navy and such and make them highly innacurate without a spotter of some sort or something like that Very Happy
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